So what's the fuss about Halo2???

[ReDeeMeR]

I must say I havent seen any video footage, but screenshots look pretty mediocre(just like HaloPC).

The gameplay was so so, great and at the same time awfull(repetetive).

Ok let's investigate the latest screenies.

Oh and btw dont flame me if you happen to be Halo fan. You may ask why I'm doing this? Well basicaly because lately there was some nice hype and fanboys like to compare Halo2 gfx to Doom3 and Half-Life 2, I've seen alot of them even saying that Halo2 looks better :p

[ReDeeMeR]

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[ReDeeMeR]

.... damn I misspelled "bunch" in here, neeeed cofffeee ;)

[ReDeeMeR]

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[RAY16]

You expect an Xbox game to have higher resolution textures then a PC game (DOOM III)? Thats just silly, and as for the the builidng being blocky, i'd like to see you design an engine with bumpmapping, pixel shader effects, vertex shadder stuff, self-showding characters and dynamic lighting, that can still render a huge city. If DOOM III had to render a whole city the buildings would be pretty blocky too, but all of DOOM III enviroments are either inside buildins or in crapmed out-door locations (like the really small research facility in the alpha). I have to say this again, why does everybody have to find something to complain about? The game still looks amazing, and you should know that screenshots never do games justice, you have to see games in motion to get the full effect. Its too easy to point out flaws in a still image, if you saw these scenes moving you wouldn't be able to notice any thing excpet for the low-poly buildings.

[ReDeeMeR]

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[RAY16]

I think the textures look extremley good for a system that has only 64Megs of DDR memory. And when you are zooming through in a warthog and exploding things you will not notice textures, and you want be focusing on the buildings either.

[ReDeeMeR]

Originally posted by RAY16
You expect an Xbox game to have higher resolution textures then a PC game (DOOM III)? Thats just silly, and as for the the builidng being blocky, i'd like to see you design an engine with bumpmapping, pixel shader effects, vertex shadder stuff, self-showding characters and dynamic lighting, that can still render a huge city. If DOOM III had to render a whole city the buildings would be pretty blocky too, but all of DOOM III enviroments are either inside buildins or in crapmed out-door locations (like the really small research facility in the alpha). I have to say this again, why does everybody have to find something to complain about? The game still looks amazing, and you should know that screenshots never do games justice, you have to see games in motion to get the full effect. Its too easy to point out flaws in a still image, if you saw these scenes moving you wouldn't be able to notice any thing excpet for the low-poly buildings.


Sorry, there's absolutely no self-showding characters in there, the in-doors trailers had a half arsed shadowing, but in these open scenes there's absolutely no self-showding characters plus the shadows are only one side or how the hell do I say this? = "Only one shadow is cast on the ground even with multiple light sources"

I'm not really asking much man, this game is being rendered at 640x480, Geforce3-4 can do this with ease. The texturing is very poor even from the distance in some places.

So as I said it looks good, but I dont undirstand fanboys bs about it beating HL2 or even Doom3? Ppl probably havent seen Doom3 videos or played the aplha?

[ReDeeMeR]

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[ReDeeMeR]

Originally posted by RAY16
I think the textures look extremley good for a system that has only 64Megs of DDR memory. And when you are zooming through in a warthog and exploding things you will not notice textures, and you want be focusing on the buildings either.

Well I really dont know how much memory it has, but that's really not the point, I've already mentioned why I posted all this above ^

[sushi128]

well, this probably isn't the case, but much of the 64mb shared memory is already used as a frame buffer for AA in most xbox games. if the xbox wants a lot of other fancy stuff, it's gonna have to rely on special techniques.

what are you comparing these graphics to?

[RAY16]

Well I really dont know how much memory it has, but that's really not the point, I've already mentioned why I posted all this above ^



I told you how much memory it has, 64MB. I have 256Megs of RAM and UT2K3 still swaps a little on normal settings, and normal textures in UT2K3 just look a little tiny bit better then in Halo 2, so its pretty damn good that Halo 2 can get these textures into 64Megs. You are just spoiled by your decently powerfull PC. Let the consoles users have a great looking game to be proud of, don't ruin it by making it your mission to point out every flaw you find. Halo 2's engine is capable of the same level of graphics as DOOM III, but the Xbox's hardware prevents bungie from using the Halo 2 engine to its fullest. If Halo 2 was made for PC with this same engine it would have much higher resolution textures and the buildings would be of a higher poly count because of the powerfull video cars that PC's have.

[sushi128]

i did some simple calculations and approx 20megs of the 64mb would be used without any cool rendering tricks and no AF. this is shared amongst the whole system. just somethin to keep in mind.....

[ReDeeMeR]

Yeah, but do you mean 64Mb of memory on graphics chip or system memory??? I thought textures are being loaded into video cards memory??? And pretty sure that's true.

[RAY16]

I don't think consoles have dedicated graphics memory, i think the memory is shared by everything in the console.

[ReDeeMeR]

Originally posted by RAY16
Let the consoles users have a great looking game to be proud of, don't ruin it by making it your mission to point out every flaw you find. Halo 2's engine is capable of the same level of graphics as DOOM III, but the Xbox's hardware prevents bungie from using the Halo 2 engine to its fullest. If Halo 2 was made for PC with this same engine it would have much higher resolution textures and the buildings would be of a higher poly count because of the powerfull video cars that PC's have.

I'm just having this bad feeling about $hitBox and M$ so I really starting to hate it, but I really didnt want to put you down man :)

[ReDeeMeR]

Originally posted by RAY16
I don't think consoles have dedicated graphics memory, i think the memory is shared by everything in the console.

Well Xbox is using NV3A chip that's essentialy Geforce 3 architecture and I dont think Nvidia went with long redesign if it's even possible to run Geforce with shared memory interface, plus motherboard and cpu are you're typical PC architecture soooo there has to be separate system ram.

[sushi128]

the xbox has 64mb dedicated DDR400 SDRAM. no debate here :)

[Hobbes874]

ReDeeMeR if your so "all-knowing" why don't you get a job a Bungie and then you can create the perfect Halo 2 because you seem to be the "expert"

[ReDeeMeR]

Originally posted by sushi128
the xbox has 64mb dedicated DDR400 SDRAM. no debate here :)

And ~64MB video memory ;)

[ReDeeMeR]

Originally posted by Hobbes874
ReDeeMeR if your so "all-knowing" why don't you get a job a Bungie and then you can create the perfect Halo 2 because you seem to be the "expert"

Duh, cause I'm getting a job @ ID software.

[Hobbes874]

Originally posted by ReDeeMeR
Duh, cause I'm getting a job @ ID software.
well ID software isn't Bungie is it? and ID software isn't designing Halo 2. and i bet you could write, program, model, design and finnish Halo 2 all by yourself because you "might" get a job a ID software?? om, ok......whatever that Gnome in your front yard tells you do........go for it i guess.

[Hitman]

Oh ohhh, sounds to me like Red is hating.. don't hate M$ cause they are business giants.. for a console game with the hardware limitations Halo 2 looks sweet no matter what it's minor faults are, although I don't own consoles and never will I want Halo 2 for the pc.

[ghiop]

Yeah, I mean, more power to consoles if they want to have games like we have on PCs. Now if they'd stop shoveling their tripe our way, it would be even better.
However, I just can't get that excited about Halo. I haven't seen it in action, though. So, I guess this is a question. Is Halo on X-Box that impressive? Or, perhaps, since everyone seems to like it--is there anything wrong with it?

[RAY16]

You have to see the video to see how impressive it is, nice lighting, the models look great, the bumpmapping looks great, and their are some huge ass explosions and nice particle effects.

[cr3am]

redeemer, go ahead and bitch and moan that a texture is ugly... especially when you're looking at it 3x bigger than you'll see it in game.

This game is futuristic, and in pretty much every futuristic movie i've seen, the apartment buildings were tall and blocky... what's the problem?

[Yian]

Well... this game looks very good to me... most gamer won't even notice the gliches ReDeMer mentioned, for those things are flawed only in a very exprienced gamer with a decent amount of knowledge of the texturing techniques. The game play is very good, though. Vehicles, smart AIs, good guns, Halo simply put everything everyone wants in all the right ways, thus this game was popular. The problem ReDeeMer pointed out could be found in Doom3's screenshots, too...

[Chimera[NL]]

He guys because I have a crappy system I NEVER got to play games with a descent framerate OR HI-RES graphics. But I usually play a game because I like the story or just the fact that you can blow people (aliens) away. If I had an XboX I wouldn't mind the graphics being a BIT lower than DoomIII or HL2. I just like games because they entertain me.

Last game I played with EVERY option on was....ehm...let me think...Quake II. :o

[ReDeeMeR]

Yeah show me any flaws in Doom3 SS, the alpha already looked better then Halo2 presentation.

I hate M$ because they took Halo and look what they made it into, the initial design was *much* better, the aliens looked scary and it was planned as a big ass MP FSP ala Tribes.

[Odm]

I honestly don't care that much about graphics in any game. So long as they're decent (ie you can tell what things are) it's fine. What I find most important is how it plays and the controls, not if it looks absolutely perfect. So what if HALO 2 has so minor graphics flaws, if it's fun then I don't care.

[ReDeeMeR]

Hmm well personaly I'm probably spoiled and my gaming excitment is slacking, cause if the gfx suck I just cant play it and there's just fewer and fewer games each year I find any good.

After HL2 and Doom3 the bar will be so fucking high I'll probably just quit being HC gamer.

Anyway as I said I just wanted to point out and ask what the fuck is so special about Halo gfx??? = Nothing, KOTOR imo looks much better overall, with detailed worlds and characters etc.

[Odm]

I think your problem is that what you call bad graphics, other people call ok graphics. It's like saying you don't like art anymore because the frames you see are too ugly compared to the ones you've seen before. It's not an essential part of the piece, but it does add to the artwork. I'd rather play a game that plays beautifully but has mediocre graphics than a game that is boring but looks amazing.

[Yian]

I had the same problem before. The first real 3-D game I got was American McGee's Alice, which uses the Quake 3 engine, and the first RTS game I played was The Age of Kings. I compared all the games I later played to those two, and I missed a lot of fun.

There are gliches in Doom3, and very visible. Use the same standard you have with Halo 2's shots, and you should find plenty.

About the graphics of the original Halo, though, nope. I don;t think it is too impressive either. As a shooter, well, it isn't as fun as those people said, in my opinion. I think there is an explanation for this: There isn't really a lot of great FPS for consoles, so when Halo came out, console kids went nuts and thought this is the only good FPS in the world, without realizing that many great FPS are already out there for PC.

[RAY16]

There isn't really a lot of great FPS for consoles, so when Halo came out, console kids went nuts and thought this is the only good FPS in the world, without realizing that many great FPS are already out there for PC.



Are you trying to say that only kids use consoles? Because thats just wrong, there are many adults that play console games. You should of said "Console Users."

[Odm]

RAY16 is right, my Uncle plays PS2... And anyways, the way I see it, while its unnecessary to have great graphics in a game (if they're good that's fine), it is better to play a game with great graphics. One thing that annoys me is that game designers focus on great graphics, and then you need better computers for the better graphics, but if you're like me you're screwed (ie stuck with your current computer).

[Yian]

Originally posted by RAY16
Are you trying to say that only kids use consoles? Because thats just wrong, there are many adults that play console games. You should of said "Console Users."
Sorry kid, I mean console users.

[ReDeeMeR]

Yeh I bet if Unreal2 came out on consoles it would be greatest game of all time.

[Yian]

Originally posted by ReDeeMeR
Yeh I bet if Unreal2 came out on consoles it would be greatest game of all time.
ReDeeMer knows exactly what I'm talking about!:D

Well, consider the fact that some people actually think that C&C Renegade is one of the best games of all time, why not Unreal 2? Especially if it is in the consoles?

[Hitman]

Show me me one person who thinks Renegade is a nice game... it was a hyped up piece of shit and still is, it's just a modern day version of Battlezone 2 and that came out way before Renegade.

:glock loaded:

[Yian]

See the first post, Hitman.

http://www.atrip.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=16436#post16436

Gee, isn't this world big...:p

[cr3am]

OMG! i just got done playing GTA:VC, and i saw these shitty entities. This game sucks, stupid entities were all wrong. How could anyone like a game with such shitty entities??? It's like, a goddamn BOX around the lights! It's half see through, why not full? OMG, i'm gonna go complain, and boycott this game. - (end sarcasm now)

[sushi128]

i think the tag is ...

besides, i didn't really like how vice city looked on the PS2. when i bumped the res up to 1280 x 1024 on my PC, all was well :D

[cr3am]

this is the PC version, on 1024x768...

OMFGZ

[cr3am]

omfgz, i can't believe i wasted my time with this

[cr3am]

ok, i really hope i disproved you when you said that one bad texture and a bad looking building makes a game suck. especially after THIS OMFGZ!@

[ReDeeMeR]

It does look like shit, LOL.

[cr3am]

Originally posted by ReDeeMeR
It does look like shit, LOL. my point is that every good game has ugly parts :rolleyes:

[ghiop]

I think Redeemer has a point. Perhaps he's nitpicking to find it, but I think what he tried to say was that the very best the X-box has to offer is less than what a brand-new PC can offer. Which is true. The same games on both systems would run better or look better on a PC, just because it has the same components as the X-box, just better. Perhaps what makes Halo 2 look so impressive (and I think we can all concede that, to a point) is not that it's the rival of HL2 or Doom 3, but that they've achieved so much with something like a computer from two years ago.

Of course, it seems like they can do more on the PC. From what I've heard, Halo is just a nice-looking shooter for the X-box. With the latest HL2 news and such, maybe the difference isn't the graphics anymore, but the world. The physics engine would be an example that springs to mind. Like I said, though, I've never played Halo, so I'm probably wrong.

[cr3am]

Originally posted by ghiop
I think Redeemer has a point. Perhaps he's nitpicking to find it, but I think what he tried to say was that the very best the X-box has to offer is less than what a brand-new PC can offer. what the fuck are you talking about? we're not comparing xbox to pc... we're not comparing an xbox game to a pc game. we're looking at xbox graphics, i simply put in some computer graphics to disprove whatever redeemer was getting at.

[ReDeeMeR]

Originally posted by ghiop
I think Redeemer has a point. Perhaps he's nitpicking to find it, but I think what he tried to say was that the very best the X-box has to offer is less than what a brand-new PC can offer. Which is true. The same games on both systems would run better or look better on a PC, just because it has the same components as the X-box, just better. Perhaps what makes Halo 2 look so impressive (and I think we can all concede that, to a point) is not that it's the rival of HL2 or Doom 3, but that they've achieved so much with something like a computer from two years ago.

Of course, it seems like they can do more on the PC. From what I've heard, Halo is just a nice-looking shooter for the X-box. With the latest HL2 news and such, maybe the difference isn't the graphics anymore, but the world. The physics engine would be an example that springs to mind. Like I said, though, I've never played Halo, so I'm probably wrong.


Yup, I was simply going over that game as I've seen the trailers and heh well it's short of anything impressive really, Unreal2 is more impressive then Halo2, it looks like a Red Faction + PS2 story, for PC crowd Red Faction was something not worth the money or time and on PS2 it was almost like a GOTY thing, I remember fanboys raving that RF is better then HL :p

As far as hardware I will bet you that HL2 will look and feel more impressive and interesting on the xbox level PC = 1000Mhz P3 + Geforce 4 Ti4200 + 256Ram.(Remember Windows eats up recourses no matter what + bugs etc)

[RAY16]

I think Redeemer has a point. Perhaps he's nitpicking to find it, but I think what he tried to say was that the very best the X-box has to offer is less than what a brand-new PC can offer. Which is true. The same games on both systems would run better or look better on a PC, just because it has the same components as the X-box, just better. Perhaps what makes Halo 2 look so impressive (and I think we can all concede that, to a point) is not that it's the rival of HL2 or Doom 3, but that they've achieved so much with something like a computer from two years ago.



There is one major thing that make a high-end PC and a Xbox Different, price. Xbox is $200 (I think M$ just lowered the price to $179 though), and a high-end PC can cost upwards of $1000. When you think of the price of the Xbox, and its less then steller specs, Halo 2 looks f'ing wonderfull.

[sushi128]

wait, i glazed over this thread before.....but, we're honestly (and logically) comparing console graphics to PC graphics? say it ain't so......

[cr3am]

Originally posted by sushi128
wait, i glazed over this thread before.....but, we're honestly (and logically) comparing console graphics to PC graphics? say it ain't so...... redeemer is looking one SMALL part of something you shouldn't even really see in the game, and says the game is gonna suck because of it.

[sushi128]

next, i say we watch final fantasy : Spirits within, then criticize PC's for having lousy textures. did i get the basic point of the thread?

or maybe i'll go back right now and actually read it all......

[WhoGivesARatsAss]

i have yet to play gta vc.. damn pirated fucked up cds.. :mad:

[TheKua]

just 14 more hours and i can get a fully operational gta:vice city and enter the matrix

[ReDeeMeR]

GTA: VC is pretty cool actualy and looks better "overall" then GTA3, but's same crap, cars are poping up on the fly and disappearing when out of range, cops are unlimited againt, saw choppers going through buildings.

Aslo this time there's somekind of a story, better characters imho to. Textures look bit crispier then PS2, but it still is a "1999 PC quality game" = dated by like 3-4 years.

[TheKua]

still i must have them both!

[cr3am]

Originally posted by WhoGivesARatsAss
i have yet to play gta vc.. damn pirated fucked up cds.. :mad: don't burn it. PM me if you want more info.

[WhoGivesARatsAss]

Originally posted by cr3am
don't burn it. PM me if you want more info.

Cream what info.. just PM me with what u got.. btw as i stated earlier.. i have to buy pirated cds.. i think i should make a thread of it!