Illegal Immigration In America

[Smapdey]

I don't see what the problem is with immigrants of any kind. Frankly, all people are just people. Black, brown, white, yellow, blue, red, green, and people with those big purple splotches, they're all just people.

If you don't believe this, you're on some level afraid of people who are different from you.

This makes you a coward.

Now you think, but I'm a bad-ass, I'm one tough motherfucker.

Then why are you living a life based upon fear?

Don't get me wrong, I love being racist, but not because I hate or fear other races, but because I think it is hilarious. This is why I think Future Man is easily the funniest person here.

To laugh is to make the best of a bad situation, but to be afraid, that's just cowardly.

For this reason I don't believe that America should bother having a standing military. It is a waste of money and just gets us into trouble (and crushing debt). We didn't have one prior to World War 2, because we have these things called oceans that protect us from everyone, but Canada and Mexico (and the last Mexican-American war was one hilarious fucking shit show from America's perspective).

Speaking of Mexico, most food in America is brought to your table (if you happen to be an America) by migrant workers who are being paid less than minimum wage. This is true of nearly all produce, meat and factory produced grain products. That's one of the big reasons why organic food and local farms are so fucking expensive, nobody is getting exploited for labor.

Here's the twisted fucking irony of this situation:

If you want to kick out all illegals, you're trying to double the cost of food and you're probably a racist.

If you don't want to kick out all illegals, probably because you think that it's racist and you're trying not to be a racist, then you're really trying to keep our current system of exploitation in place. Racist.

Fuck-a-doodle-do.

[Fatty]

I wouldn't care if they paid their taxes. No taxes - get the fuck out.

[Yian]

I'm leaving US at the end of this year and going back to Taiwan. I am done with this country.

You know the poll they did recently?

"While the vast majority surveyed said that most immigrants are basically good, honest and hard-working, nearly 70 percent believed that immigrants are a burden on the taxpayer, 62 percent think they add to the crime problem, and 59 percent believe they take jobs away from Americans."

So, if I leave, that one less problem for you. You guys must be really happy.

[Smapdey]

No taxes - get the fuck out.

Are you in favor of throwing out children and senior citizens too? They don't pay taxes and are the majority group to not pay taxes in America.

[Fatty]

I'm talking about state/federal income tax. If you make money in any country, you should be paying taxes. Our public schools, roads, medicare, police and fire departments are all funded by taxes. Illegal immigrants and other people who get paid under the table are taking advantage of everyone else who actually does pay their taxes by using these services for free.

[Smapdey]

Illegal Immigrants don't really get access to those services (apart from the roads, and we let any 16 year old with a license and car use those even though they don't pay shit). Trust me, when they're terrified that the government will find them out and send them back, they don't bother calling the police or the fire department.

The people in this country who don't pay state or federal income tax are largely the unemployed, the elderly or children. Illegal immigrants are so underpaid typically that there isn't much of anything to tax.

Also, I don't see why they would pay taxes to a country that refuses to grant them citizenship and therefore even the most basic rights or services.

Meanwhile, there are people who get more money than anyone actually knows what to do with. I would be more in favor of limiting the maximum amount of wealth anyone can control than trying to tax people who don't have fuck all to tax in the first place.

[future man]

I just hate all the fucking garbage they leave on local trails, holy fucking shit, it's awful.

[schnitzel_bob]

I'm talking about state/federal income tax. If you make money in any country, you should be paying taxes. Our public schools, roads, medicare, police and fire departments are all funded by taxes. Illegal immigrants and other people who get paid under the table are taking advantage of everyone else who actually does pay their taxes by using these services for free.

If you want them to pay taxes then surely you agree they should be paid the legal minimum wage?

I'm quite pro-immigration, being from a country in which immigrants stole from the native population. In my mind, unless you're aboriginal, you can't morally object to immigration in North America. Period.

Anyhow, South Park pretty neatly covered my opinion on the whole 'illegal' thing. Not that we have to deal with illegal immigration in Canada on anywhere near the level you folks do (though in places like Vancouver it's pretty widespread).


DEY TURK ER JERBS!!!

[Yian]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/16/business/global/16yuan.html?_r=1&partner=rss&emc=rss

I guess it isn't so bad going back home now. CYA FELLOWS!

[tisl]

So why are you going back? What have you experienced that makes you so eager to leave the US?

[worsen]

So why are you going back? What have you experienced that makes you so eager to leave the US?


So, if I leave, that one less problem for you. You guys must be really happy.

Sounds like a concern over bigotry to me.

[Hobbes874]

Don't worry Yian, illiterate white folks are only afraid of three types of 'others': negros, mexicans and aaayy-rabs. Us Chinamen are A-OK!


I once knew an illegal immigrant from Canada, he was white as snow (i.e Taco Bell salsa made him tear up). Sorta funny because there is no way he'd be pulled over in Arizona.

[Yian]

So why are you going back? What have you experienced that makes you so eager to leave the US?

Let me just name a few instances of the warm hospitality the United States has offered me.

When I first came to this country, I went to an American public school. I imagine that's an unpleasant experience for some of you, but I wouldn't know because they actually placed in in a special-ed class. Apparently, for a town hat is as white as a ghost, if you can't speak English, you are a retard. It's always refreshing to be frowned upon by truck drivers because I don't get skin cancer when it's too hot out.

In Pennsylvania, someone once grabbed me by the chin while I was with my friends at a bar. The dude tole me that he doesn't want to see any of "my kind" in this town. All I wanted was some fucking wings.

When I was in college, a professor once pointed out my accent and told the entire class that, when I speak English, she wasn't even sure if I was speaking a language at all. The laughter of the entire class convinced me that I was born for a purpose and destined to do good for humanity.

Another different professor told me that graphic design is one of those Americans things that a Chinese like me will never "get it."

You see, I believe that it is biologically impossible for the citizens of a country that possess the largest military to understand how to respect minority. Someone I knew once get really pissed of at the film Borat, because it was homophobic and racist, but this same person had no trouble telling me that, unlike European accent, my accent sound really stupid and unattractive and I should go to an acting school and learn how to talk. Since then, every time he sees me, he will say "have you signed up for an acting school yet?"

There is this person in my neighborhood that insist greeting me "the Chinese way" every time he sees me, with both of his palms touching each other and bow, like I am a mini Chinese ancestral shrine. Was there smoke coming out of my ears?

My college folks decided that I should sing a song at the graduation ceremony because I sounded like William Huang from American Idol, they specifically asked me to sing "She Bangs." I didn't do it, and they actually called me "anti-social" and "loser" for my refusal.

One of my roommates once volunteered to teach me how to wash dishes on the first day I moved in, because he heard that Chinese don't know how to use soap. Then, he volunteered again to show me how to flush a toilet.

I thought the search at the airport was random, but for some reason I always get picked. I'm not sure if it was racism, though. Maybe I am just lucky that way.

Someone once threw a cigarette butt at me and yelled "go back to China." I probably will.

There were also a few times violence was involved. You guys must have at least seen it in a movie, when someone smashed a person's head with a glass beer bottle? I can tell you that it actually hurts. You feel dizzy too. They did tell me why they did it, though, because I am a fucking chink. Did he mean that I looked like a chipmunk... duh?

I once worked for a computer store that asked me to do three jobs - design and build websites, fix all the computers, and make brochures and billboards for clients. My pay? Minimum wage. Originally I was hired just to help fix the computer, but soon I have three full-time jobs. I told my boss that I either get a big raise or I will quit, he remarked that "I thought Chinese are very hard working people."

The list could go on and I only listed things that are right on top of my head. But you get the idea.

One of the reason I like this place is because you guys wouldn't hate me as much if you don't hear my broken English and the way I look.

You see, Asians do not fare any better when it comes to racism. We have all kinds of misconceptions and bigotry toward the white and the black, too. The kind of things they say about other races in my country are even more grossly misinformed and stereotypical. But at least they won't do it to me, because, you see, I am one of them.

When i was very young, I was naive and bought into the American imperialist pigs' propaganda and I came here to seek my chance at a worldly stage. Now I realized that, however bad my country was, it was not like Sudan or Ethiopia so there was no reason to leave. I could at least have pride if I live among my kind. If i am willing to get down to my knees and suck the white man's balls because this country advertise itself to be the best country in the world, where is my sense of dignity?

Maybe that is why people look down at me, because I am a coward. I am willing to endure the bullying from white men just so I could stay in this country. Um, sorry, but no. Fuck you.

[RAY16]

Well, after running into the type of morons you've described it's no wonder you're a tad soured on living here.

[Yian]

I just read what I wrote, and I think I owe you guys an apology. I did not mean to imply that you guys would behave the same if you were to meet me in person. You guys have been cool and generous for years and I think you deserve at least the courtesy of not presumed guilty until proven innocent. So, sorry about.

It's just frustrating sometimes, knowing that you will always live as a second-class citizen on a land you are trying so hard to believe to be the answer to a lot of the problems. I think my outlook and perspective in life has changed a little as I grow older, and what used to bother me in my home country doesn't really bother me anymore, which begs the question why I am here.

[schnitzel_bob]

I just read what I wrote, and I think I owe you guys an apology. I did not mean to imply that you guys would behave the same if you were to meet me in person. You guys have been cool and generous for years and I think you deserve at least the courtesy of not presumed guilty until proven innocent. So, sorry about.

It's just frustrating sometimes, knowing that you will always live as a second-class citizen on a land you are trying so hard to believe to be the answer to a lot of the problems. I think my outlook and perspective in life has changed a little as I grow older, and what used to bother me in my home country doesn't really bother me anymore, which begs the question why I am here.

Come to Canada. We're only racist towards aboriginals.

[Smapdey]

I still want to leave the United States and I am a white person. Most Americans are fucking retarded. The US is an empire in decline. I fear that the Chinese government will rise to take its place and begin to police the globe. There will probably be a big war first though.

This is one of the big reasons I can't quit smoking. I always feel like the world is about to end. I know that the US will probably start it, and lose. I'll be surprised if I don't die in a nuclear holocaust.

I said Chinese government though, and not Chinese people. The Chinese as individuals I know are some of the coolest people I've ever met. Their government is fucking scary, but mine is closer to home and probably a bigger threat.
This includes you, Yian (the cool Chinese part, not the scary government part). You're a tremendously talented artist, and you're more qualified than I am to run the business I own. I assume that the American government won't let you own a business, but they'll let me do it and I'm more than willing to help you fuck over the Imperialist pigs as it were by doing well in this country to spite them by piggy-backing on my rights and what the system has allowed me to set up. IM me and we'll talk if you're interested. I think you and I might be able to come up with some worthwhile projects. It really doesn't matter where you are though, so don't think you need to stay here if you feel it is time to leave. I want to leave this fucking stupid country too.

I have made fun of people for their accent, but I've also had mine made fun of (usually by other Americans, fucking mid-westerners). I'm sorry people are so hateful towards you. Americans are largely retards. It's because the Republican party has repeatedly slashed our education budget so people will remain ignorant and keep the status quo in power.

Your comment on the military however is why I personally feel the need to leave this country. I'm doing my homework and thinking I'm going to get the fuck out of the United States as soon as the opportunity presents itself.

[tisl]

Holy shit, people are fucking retarded. I mean, I knew that already, but a professor actually saying that in front of a class. I don't care about the context, it's unacceptable. This is why dogs are better than people. They don't do retarded shit like this.

[Hobbes874]

Gdamn Yian, that is some pretty severe racism. I know a couple Chinese nationals and have never heard anything even close to that. Perhaps it comes down to the area/town you lived in? Some smaller towns can be a bit more secluded culturally and act/say things on the basis that they're ignorant and not truly racist (Chinese bow, Soap thing). I'd take it living in San Fran you haven't received any treatment like that?

Personally I've only had one encounter that might be considered racism, when a black girl (ironic, no?), told me to "get out of the way Chinamen!" as she chased down a ball in 6th grade gym.

Another encounter that wasn't malicious but sorta humorous was a bum asking me for change like a year ago. He was taken back by my deep voice when I proclaimed I didn't have any and proceeded to tell me that "Your voice doesn't match your...look (140lbs).....but you know Bruce Lee wasn't huge but could fuck people up!"

My lack of contact with racism might be due to the fact that I'm American born (Perhaps a Chinese accent would bring more problems?). Could also be the area I live in (Southwest), which is pretty culturally diverse, making people around here that much more accepting. Not sure if being half-white makes much of a difference, honestly I can't tell if other races besides Asians can tell if somebody is a half-breed.

[IcedEarth]

Come to Canada. We're only racist towards aboriginals.

Except the stereotypes are actually true for the most part.

[schnitzel_bob]

Except the stereotypes are actually true for the most part.

Right, to a certain extent, but there's still a low level racism in dealing with aboriginals that this entire country exhibits. I'm not acting high and mighty, I've totally done it. It really doesn't help that we're apparently unable to have a national conversation about it.
That said, aboriginal people in Canada have to prove themselves beyond their ethnic background. If I go get a job somewhere, they hire me as a white guy with no baggage. If an aboriginal person gets a job, they have to prove they're "not just some drunk native". I'm not saying there aren't a lot of drunk natives in Winnipeg, but it's not fair that every aboriginal person should have to overcome stereotypes before they get treated like a normal person.

[Hobbes874]

I take it Canadian aboriginals are Native Americans to us in the U.S?

[Yian]

I wonder what you have in mind, Smap?

[schnitzel_bob]

I take it Canadian aboriginals are Native Americans to us in the U.S?

Yeah, same thing. I don't really know what the issues are regarding native americans there, but in Canada being aboriginal is kind of like being Black in parts of the US.

[Hobbes874]

Our natives get a lot of slack for spending all their time drinking and getting diabetes. Even with the casinos, the areas they live in are pretty crappy imo.

[IcedEarth]

Our natives get a lot of slack for spending all their time drinking and getting diabetes. Even with the casinos, the areas they live in are pretty crappy imo.

Exactly like Canada. They live off the fat of the land, just in a different way now. Bob makes a good point, though. Unfortunately, hard working Natives ARE the minority in Winnipeg, which makes it even harder for them to get ahead. I have total respect for those that overcome the stereotypes and are a legit part of the workforce.

My feelings are to cut the goddamn financial assistance for those that just happened to be born Native. I'm 1/4 Ukrainian. You don't see me going after the Russian government for compensation. Relatively speaking, the Natives have been EXTREMELY fortunate in how they've been treated since losing their land. Look all through history, the same thing has happened to countless groups. Very few see any kind of RECOGNITION, let alone compensation. How long am I going to have to continue directly paying for lazy Natives that sit around, drink and complain about how my ancestors did their ancestors wrong? It's fucking ridiculous. I'd feel different if not so many of them were a useless drain on society.

I'm not trying to deny that Natives have had it hard or been treated horribly at times in the past. Residential Schools are just a horrible nightmare that anyone outside Canada would probably have a hard time believing our government had anything to do with, but they did. I just think it's time to stop giving special treatment to Natives now. Eliminating the special treatment would probably eliminate a lot of the resentment. Not all, but some.

[Hobbes874]

^Sort of interesting how closely that mimics my feelings. I honestly didn't know the same transgressions occurred to natives in Canada like they did in the U.S. Makes sense though.

But yeah, my problem is how guilt still seems to play into the generous subsidies Native families receive to this day. E.g: I knew this one obese chick that worked in a building on campus. She had her first child at like 18 (that father was in prison last I checked) and two more after that before the age of 21 with another dude. She worked in a student position that paid $8 an hour (worked less than 25hrs a week mind you). Despite all this, she still managed to feed 3 chubby kids, cloth them and afford a home on the reservation due partially to government incentives. Now in principle this isn't a bad thing (kids get a home and food). But I just see a setup for this cycle to occur again each generation :(. The kids have different fathers (both of which served time) and their mother would occasionally smell like booze in the middle of a weekday....

Removal of the federal milk bottle is long past due. Instead give them planned parenthood and some AA classes.

Are the reservation roadways in Canada covered in anti-meth and drunk driving billboards (specifically with natives in the imagery) like they are here?

[IcedEarth]

^ Can't say I've seen that, no.

I agree with what you say about breaking the cycle so to speak. However, I can't imagine how much the Natives would cry if that ever did happen. Fuck, they cry NOW how they don't have any opportunities to get ahead, when in reality, they are given PLENTY of opportunities in the form of financial assistance and an "affirmative action" of sorts for Natives. If you're a Native woman, you should have NO excuse for not having a job other than your own self-created problems/laziness. There are also all kinds of programs and centers where you can go to get help with writing a resume if you don't have a computer or know how to write one.

[worsen]

I don't understand how the losers of historical battles can really complain. If you (~your ancestors~, who, may I remind you have nothing to do with you) didn't have the tech/cunning to win, then tough shit.

THEIR descendents, however, may have some grounds for complaint, but generally people are lazy - native, immigrant or |otherwise|.

Just try to rip off everyone else, best way.

[Yian]

What do you do for a living, worsen? Why do you feel people are generally lazy?

[worsen]

I rip off lazy people for a living, and I generally think people are lazy because I R capitalist. I was very pissed last post so I apologise. :P

(okay maybe i'll tell you what i do for a living at a later date.)

edit: maybe i should clarify - i think racism should be assumed dead and anyone who exhibits racist behaviour may aswell be shot cos it ain't me.

edit2: I realised Yian is the most mild mannered person here, he should be the one to do the shooting.

edit3: god damn it, i just put my phone in the washing machine, and clearly this is the appropriate forum through which to express my irritation.

[Yian]

LOL I'm a little racist myself, so I wouldn't want to shoot anyone dead.

[worsen]

GOD DAMN, KILL YIAN, KILL

[RAY16]

LOL I'm a little racist myself, so I wouldn't want to shoot anyone dead.

Just shoot out their kneecaps, then.

[schnitzel_bob]

I’ve been thinking about this a lot. Not specifically as a result of this discussion, though that did spur it on recently. My specific area of study is Canadian politics, and the issue of Aboriginals is one of the most intractable in Canada, so I've studied it at least peripherally.

I appreciate your frustration, Iced and Hobbes. I really do. I’ve been to a few reserves, and they’re exactly what you’d expect. It’s unfortunate. My brother was working construction at a school on a reserve a few years ago, and the school was going to throw away a piano because no one played it. My brother asked if he could have it, and they said sure, so we loaded it into a truck and brought it to his place. It was a perfectly good piano, plays fine, but they were just gonna throw it away, because they just didn't give a fuck.

Like you, Iced, I can’t go downtown without seeing a drunk native person begging for change. Like you, I notice that 8 out of 10 stabbings in this city happen in the same areas, areas which happen to have very high Aboriginal populations.

I’m not quite as hard-nosed about it, though. First, can we agree that no amount of reparations can ever undo the damage of taking the land of Aboriginals? Notwithstanding anything else, we can’t really ever make-up for that. I know, we need to move on, but I think too many people aren’t willing to accept that basic point.

Consider that the last residential school was closed in 1986. That’s the year I was born. Consider also that the parents of people our age are the ones who were sent to residential school. The impact of something like that is unfathomable. I know you mentioned that, Iced, but the point I’m trying to make is to ask how a generation that was really fucked up can go on to raise a generation of well-adjusted individuals. Knowing what we know, we shouldn’t be surprised when alcoholism and abuse are major problems on reserves and among aboriginals more generally.

When you say that a native woman has no excuse not to have a job, I think you’re being too blunt. Hypothetically, let’s say an Aboriginal woman was molested as a child, huffed gas and got into harder stuff as she grew up, had some kids in her late 'teens (who have Fetal Alcohol Syndrome) and now, in her early twenties wants to do something with her life. What the fuck kind of starting point is that? It takes more than free education and daycare to move past blocks like that.

Of course, that’s an extreme case, but you see what I’m saying.

But, yeah, I get frustrated too. Clearly, the reserve system is fucked. For christ’s sake, you stick people in the ass end of nowhere, give them some rifles and expect them to preserve their culture in 2010? That’s idiotic, and it hasn’t ever worked. There are no jobs on reserves except those related to the government. Corruption among reserve governments is also much more prevalent than would be acceptable for mainstream politics. Besides, 50% of aboriginals in Canada live in big cities, and they don't fit anywhere in the 'official' structure of aboriginal affairs. There is no will on the part of government in this country to deal with it. The provinces and the federal government mainly just shift the blame. I’m very aware of the constitutional issues behind this, but if the governments in this country were committed to doing something about it, we could move forward. Claiming that they can’t agree on anything is a poor excuse.

Throwing money at the problem isn’t the solution. Millions of dollars have been spent, reports have been commissioned, politicians have made commitments and very little has changed. Yes, there are some positive stories. I think that part of the problem is that the only time non-Aboriginal Canadians hear about Aboriginals is in a very negative way. Generally, though, the same basic problems that existed 40 years ago exist today.

I very strongly disagree about cutting off the tap, though. I think most Canadians would probably be mostly ok with putting money towards Aboriginals if two things happen:

1- If we saw progress; if there were visible signs that the money spent wasn’t going to waste, people would be more accepting.

2- If we stop getting told we’re not allowed to have an opinion on the matter.

That last point really bothers me. Too often the debate gets reduced to "goddamned drunk natives" on the one hand and "you stole our land therefore you have no right to an opinion" on the other. Taxpayers foot the bill for programs for aboriginals, so yeah, we do have the right to an opinion. Besides, non-aboriginal Canadians are going to have to work with aboriginals to make this work, so lets stop pretending we can live independently of each other in the same goddamned city, or province, or country.

In Canada, we desperately need to have a national conversation about this. We need an open and frank discussion. I have very little hope that it will happen any time soon though.

[IcedEarth]

^ I pretty much agree with everything you said.

Your last two points there are the main things that bother me. Especially the lack of any progress made. What's frustrating is giving hand-outs to people who do nothing with it but drink and perpetuate the cycle of laziness. That's why I think instead of giving the money directly to the Natives, it should go toward social programs that focus on education, rehabilitation, employment skills, etc.

[RAY16]

^ I pretty much agree with everything you said.

Your last two points there are the main things that bother me. Especially the lack of any progress made. What's frustrating is giving hand-outs to people who do nothing with it but drink and perpetuate the cycle of laziness. That's why I think instead of giving the money directly to the Natives, it should go toward social programs that focus on education, rehabilitation, employment skills, etc.

But then the people running those social programs become corrupt and pocket more than they spend.

[schnitzel_bob]

But then the people running those social programs become corrupt and pocket more than they spend.

You assume that right from the word go? That's kind of fucked up. Corrupt bureaucrats are the least of your worries. I'd be more concerned with corporate interests controlling the voting pattern of your elected officials.

[Alchi]

Plastic voice starts speaking:

-Allright Yin, let's see what we have here.

An aspiring young artist wants to leave United States (a.k.a. 'kitchen of the world'... see what I did there? No? Fuck you), because they suck. Can't blame you, I don't like it either. He wants to go back to china, because that's where he was born. What do you think, John?

-Home sweet home, Jim.

-True, John. But there's always another option.

-What's that, Jim?

-How about Middle-east, John?

-Too hot, too sandy, too many camels, Jim.

-You're right, John. Camels are smelly. Got anything ?

-How about Europe, Jim?

-Yes, exactly. Sounds like a wonderful place for an ARTIST to go... to. You know Europe is a region that could give a lot to an ARTIST that wants to live there and get creative. Just don't go to eastern block, because it's kinda fucked up and poor. So that's our advise, right John?

-Yes, Jim.

-John...

And... scene

No need of applause, you can sit down, this piece was written by a psychopathic thirteen-year-old part of my brain.

Seriously, lad, you never gave any thought of moving to Europe? Come on, we don't wear brown shirts and red armbands anymore. Unless Dolce and Gabbana tells us to... Well there are a bit of neo-nazies involved, but if you fear those, you should stick to France, Italy, Holland, Spain... well Britain (they have other... issues). And we are not over-run by muslims... yet... except Germany, which is full of Turks.

If you do move to Europe, you shouldn't be surprised that young people aren't that different from americans. Cultural differences and identities are going away fast all over the world. I blame mass culture, internet, TV, cheap booze and Google (they know what they do). Soon we will all speak the same english, eat the same shitty food and tell the same lame catch-phrases. Which is a sad thing and wayyy out of topic.

I really don't think you would be discriminated for being ugly-speaking and looking asian artist. You're an artist, who gives a shit how you look as long as you bring it good (Michelangelo, anyone?). All you need to be is a bitch to societies craving for pretty stuff and put your life and soul into it, untill you will be toyed and bored public, looking for something new, will literally discard you into scrapheap for being behind-the-times and stagnant, where you will live and die, impoverished everyday looking for something to eat in what other have thrown away...

So... Europe then?


Now, if you will excuse me, I will now go to Brussels to get my paycheck for promoting Europe.

[MadMonk2]

I have nothing against immigration... but I do have much against illegal immigration! I don't care what country that a immigrant comes from, as long as they do it legally.
I am in a state state is called a Sanctuary State, there are three of them, and Washington is one. With a sanctuary state anyone can get a drivers license with just the proof of a state address.... an electric bill or whatever that comes to an address. Once this is had, then they have an identification that is accepted anywhere as an apparent verification that they are legal. From these three states, they go anywhere.
Then there are sanctuary cities in every state.
What the game is that once they have the license and come up with any SS card number (just in case one is asked for), they can work and also draw any social services available. What is horrible is that I know of aliens (and I can't do anything about it, INS or ICE won't touch them) that are drawing well over 2 grand a month and yet some little old american lady that worked 40 years for a five and dime is only drawing $600. I have a great big problem with this. My opinion dose'nt count for much, but I think that any and all should be sent back where they come from, and if they want to come legally,let them. If they come illegally again, put them somewhere for a long time, and make them work. And these anchor babies, no automatic citizenship, but if they are born on american soil, they should go with the parents to wherever the parents came from.. but at the age of 18 they should have the choice of citizenship, and even then they should go through an immigration course as well.
I don't think that an illegal should receive any services other than their transport out of here.
AS for the cost of fruit and veggies.... coming from an agricultural state, higher prices is a bunch of BULL! For one thing they are paid by the Bin, not by the hour. They get paid for what they pick, and that only.

[Smapdey]

"And these anchor babies, no automatic citizenship"

Yes, um, how did your family get citizenship again?

[King Speedy]

"And these anchor babies, no automatic citizenship"

Yes, um, how did your family get citizenship again?

We wrote reviews for lousy gaming sites.

[Fatty]

"And these anchor babies, no automatic citizenship"

Yes, um, how did your family get citizenship again?

They went to America and applied for citizenship?

[Smapdey]

You know, I highly doubt any of my ancestors did that. We had next to zero immigration controls for a large part of this nation's history, and in the Southwest the border has done a lot of moving over the years.

I don't see the reason to fear peaceful people who are simply seeking to better themselves. Sure some will take advantage of the system, but most won't.

This is just another issue that is being used to divide the American people and play off of people's worst sides, their fear, anger and hatred.

There is nothing wrong with most Mexicans.

[MadMonk2]

"And these anchor babies, no automatic citizenship"

Yes, um, how did your family get citizenship again?

As an answer to your question, the first of my family arrived on the continent in the 1660's... fittingly, they were Boat Wrights. And in the area that they were in, were English subjects. Thanks for your question

[Smapdey]

So they just kind of showed up here, lived on land stolen from the native Americans, and now you're trying to complain about immigration?

[Fatty]

We killed the Indians and claimed the land for ourselves. Fair game.

[MadMonk2]

So they just kind of showed up here, lived on land stolen from the native Americans, and now you're trying to complain about immigration?

Yea, they just kinda showed up..... and the other half of the family met them.
The other half is Cherokee and Lakota Sioux!

[SPaRKY]

We killed the Indians and claimed the land for ourselves. Fair game.

according to some history books, which I know history can be heavily altered, like 90percent of them died from diseases that we brought over from europe, which we were pre-immune to.

i mean just a few settlers with muskets < a shitload of indians trained well in combat

oh wait i guess we gave them blankets with the diseases so thats kinda like bio warfare